Sociology Professor Emerita Arlie Russell Hochschild spoke to The New York Times for an episode of "The Opinions" podcast.
In this episode of “The Opinions,” the editorial board director David Leonhardt talks to Arlie Russell Hochschild about why voters in Appalachia continue to support the president, despite the broken promises of Trump’s first term and looming cuts to social programs they depend on.
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The transcript has been lightly edited for length and clarity.
David Leonhardt: I’m David Leonhardt, the director of the New York Times editorial board. Every week I’m having conversations to help shape the board’s opinions.
This week I’m talking with Arlie Russell Hochschild. She’s an eminent sociologist who a decade ago coined the term, “the great paradox.” It describes the fact that hatred of government often seems to be most intense among people who most rely on government. And that working-class voters are increasingly turning against policies and politicians that seem to benefit those voters.
Donald Trump’s second term has made the great paradox all the more relevant. He’s shutting down government agencies and his bill that he’s trying to pass through Congress would cut taxes for the rich while taking away health insurance from the middle class and poor. And yet millions of Donald Trump supporters continue to stand strongly by him.
I asked Arlie to come on our show and talk about all this. She recently wrote an essay for Times Opinion about her reporting in Eastern Kentucky’s Fifth Congressional District and it’s a place where she spent years reporting for her book, “Stolen Pride.” ArlieHochschild, thanks for joining us.
Arlie Hochschild: Thank you very much, David Leonhardt. Delighted to be here.
Leonhardt: Let’s start by setting a scene. I know you’re based in Berkeley, Calif., which is a very different place from Eastern Kentucky. Can you just talk to us about what Eastern Kentucky and towns like Pikeville, Ky., are like?
Hochschild: It’s beautiful. There are mountains around and what you can’t see is that there’s a lot of coal in them. This is the whitest and third-poorest congressional district in the nation. It’s got a history that you see as you’re driving around — closed mines and coal machinery, kind of like corpses.
Coal was a source of great pride for people. We kept the lights on. We won World War I and World War II. And now it’s gone, so you see a loss, you see a gone-ness. You see places where stores used to be. You see schools that are now closed. And when you get to talk to people, the first thing they’ll talk about is the past and how it was.
These days, the largest employer is not a coal mine, it’s the Pikeville Medical Center. A lot of the top doctors are actually recruited from India, Pakistan, other places, and the nurses are trained local women, usually women. So it gives you a feeling of something lost. And when you talk to people, that’s what you hear.